Some words - cars

General car gossip.

Re: Some words - cars

Post by Greg66 @ Wed Nov 11, 2020 8:32 pm

Did they just draw some lines on the battery?
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by S1K @ Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:02 pm

BMW is the car company who has fallen the furthest in the ranks of styling. When you think of the cars they used to make and how desirable they were as objects and then look at 90% of the cars they make today it’s almost enough to bring a tear to the eye. They must still know how to make an attractive car, the current M5 isn’t terrible, so what the absolute fcuk are they doing?
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Doctor Congo @ Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:34 pm

S1K wrote:BMW is the car company who has fallen the furthest in the ranks of styling. When you think of the cars they used to make and how desirable they were as objects and then look at 90% of the cars they make today it’s almost enough to bring a tear to the eye. They must still know how to make an attractive car, the current M5 isn’t terrible, so what the absolute fcuk are they doing?


Appealing to the China market apparently. Maybe they hold focus groups in China to design their cars. Then they end up with a car like Homer Simpson designed.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by manfromdelmonte @ Wed Nov 11, 2020 10:52 pm

They already have about 38 different models, would it kill them to develop a Western and an Eastern flavour of the main ones?
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by S1K @ Wed Nov 11, 2020 10:54 pm

I think the whole “appealing to China” thing is a bit of a red herring anyway. Didn’t the Chinese want to own BMW’s when they looked good? The problem was that they couldn’t get them or couldn’t afford them, not that they didn’t like the look of them.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by manfromdelmonte @ Wed Nov 11, 2020 11:07 pm

That car looks like a brown herring.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Damien Thorn @ Thu Nov 12, 2020 8:30 am

I think Mercedes have got their current styling at least as bad a BMW have. At least BMWs look like BMWs, albeit Sitting Image caricatures of BMWs.

Mercs all just look like sad-faced Hyundais now.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Greg66 @ Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:04 pm

I have it (the red Panamera). I collected it just outside Newbury and drove it back to London.

Longer first impressions: Porsche’s in car entertainment/car configuration thing is comfortably the most complicated and least intuitive I’ve ever encountered. Once we got it going though it was pretty good.

There are a lot of blank buttons - a function of it being a bit povvo spec and Porsche having a ridiculous options list. But it’s got everything I want except a heated screen which I don’t think Porsche do so shits will not be given on that score.

The engine is very quiet and very smooth, which I suppose is a V6’s trump card. The ride is excellent and unlike some cars you don’t need special sensors in your arse to detect the changes in ride quality as you switch from comfort to sport to sport plus. Playing with the manual mode of the PDK gearbox doesn’t seem any different so far to sticking a tiptronic/auto into “manual”. Shifts are seamless even with your foot planted. First is super short though so you shift within a second or two of moving.

It’s not small. It’s really a reversion to my S8 size wise except your sit lower, the wing mirrors are tiny and the rear view mirror is even smaller and has to look through a small rear window. So rearward visibility isn’t great.

Overall package so far: really, really good. It’s faster than the S8 but conceals speed better. And the ride is better too. And it’s quieter, which is bad because a V10 sounds great but being quiet is very refined.

And I like the red. There’s a touch a darkness in it which means it’s not like wearing a seven year old’s trousers on the outside of your car.

I’ll do photos and a longer write up in a bit.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Doctor Congo @ Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:15 pm

Greg66 wrote:I have it (the red Panamera). I collected it just outside Newbury and drove it back to London.

Longer first impressions: Porsche’s in car entertainment/car configuration thing is comfortably the most complicated and least intuitive I’ve ever encountered. Once we got it going though it was pretty good.

There are a lot of blank buttons - a function of it being a bit povvo spec and Porsche having a ridiculous options list. But it’s got everything I want except a heated screen which I don’t think Porsche do so shits will not be given on that score.

The engine is very quiet and very smooth, which I suppose is a V6’s trump card. The ride is excellent and unlike some cars you don’t need special sensors in your arse to detect the changes in ride quality as you switch from comfort to sport to sport plus. Playing with the manual mode of the PDK gearbox doesn’t seem any different so far to sticking a tiptronic/auto into “manual”. Shifts are seamless even with your foot planted. First is super short though so you shift within a second or two of moving.

It’s not small. It’s really a reversion to my S8 size wise except your sit lower, the wing mirrors are tiny and the rear view mirror is even smaller and has to look through a small rear window. So rearward visibility isn’t great.

Overall package so far: really, really good. It’s faster than the S8 but conceals speed better. And the ride is better too. And it’s quieter, which is bad because a V10 sounds great but being quiet is very refined.

And I like the red. There’s a touch a darkness in it which means it’s not like wearing a seven year old’s trousers on the outside of your car.

I’ll do photos and a longer write up in a bit.


Well done Greggers. Another car on my want list. Photos please!
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Deuteronomy @ Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:31 am

Greg66 wrote:I have it (the red Panamera). I collected it just outside Newbury and drove it back to London.

Longer first impressions: Porsche’s in car entertainment/car configuration thing is comfortably the most complicated and least intuitive I’ve ever encountered. Once we got it going though it was pretty good.

There are a lot of blank buttons - a function of it being a bit povvo spec and Porsche having a ridiculous options list. But it’s got everything I want except a heated screen which I don’t think Porsche do so shits will not be given on that score.

The engine is very quiet and very smooth, which I suppose is a V6’s trump card. The ride is excellent and unlike some cars you don’t need special sensors in your arse to detect the changes in ride quality as you switch from comfort to sport to sport plus. Playing with the manual mode of the PDK gearbox doesn’t seem any different so far to sticking a tiptronic/auto into “manual”. Shifts are seamless even with your foot planted. First is super short though so you shift within a second or two of moving.

It’s not small. It’s really a reversion to my S8 size wise except your sit lower, the wing mirrors are tiny and the rear view mirror is even smaller and has to look through a small rear window. So rearward visibility isn’t great.

Overall package so far: really, really good. It’s faster than the S8 but conceals speed better. And the ride is better too. And it’s quieter, which is bad because a V10 sounds great but being quiet is very refined.

And I like the red. There’s a touch a darkness in it which means it’s not like wearing a seven year old’s trousers on the outside of your car.

I’ll do photos and a longer write up in a bit.


Good - I want to know more.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Turntable @ Tue Nov 17, 2020 3:41 pm

Hurry up Greg. I want to know more. So many times I have considered those and not gone ahead.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Deuteronomy @ Tue Nov 17, 2020 4:04 pm

Turntable wrote:Hurry up Greg. I want to know more. So many times I have considered those and not gone ahead.


Imagine if it turns out he didn't buy the V8 Turbo!!

Oh how we'd laugh!
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Greg66 @ Tue Nov 17, 2020 5:05 pm

Deuteronomy wrote:
Turntable wrote:Hurry up Greg. I want to know more. So many times I have considered those and not gone ahead.


Imagine if it turns out he didn't buy the V8 Turbo!!

Oh how we'd laugh!



<flicks V sign at Doots>

So you want more, eh?

Well. It’s a 2014 V6 3.0 twin turbo. So much for hating turbo’d engines. Or maybe I just haven’t grown to hate this one yet.

2014 means it is a gen 1 face lifted model. Probably important in some obscure Porcine way. For the money I would have been hard pressed to find a gen 1 pre face lift V8 turbo with mileage in the 60s. This is coming up on 32,000. As it does 0-60 in under 5 seconds and tops out at 174 I’m not really seeing the case for the V8 turbo, at least for me when I have the Aston to provide mega grunt or mega noise if I need it.

The bodywork looks immaculate. I can’t find a mark on it. The interior trim looks factory fresh except for the edge of the driver’s side driver’s window raiser switch. It just looks amazing.

Except, I suppose, for the array of reminders that it’s probably a bit povvo spec, in the shape of blank buttons. But it has all the toys I want in a car and none of the ones I don’t (eg lane assist, brake assist, adaptive cruise - I can manage without those thanks because I don’t drink or sleep while I drive). On Friday it’s going off to the local place to have CarPlay fitted which will remove some of the labyrinthine complexity of Porsche’s own offering, thank fcuk.

Speaking of which it came with no service book or manuals. I’ve got a replacement service book which has been stamped by the supplying dealer and first dealer to service it and is now at the second and most recent dealer for a stamp. It was “serviced” by the seller but I’ll put it into Porsche Chiswick for a wallet filleting and the stamp so that it will become FPSH.

Driving: the engine’s quiet and smooth in the way that a six cylinder engine is. It’s so quiet and smooth that I’ve had the gearbox in manual a couple of times and noticed the rev needle at 5000 as I poodle along in first. Whoops. I can feel the first and second turbo come in but two seems less intrusive than one so maybe I won’t grow to hate that.

The gearbox: for all the stuff I’ve read about PDK etc dual clutch boxes being fantastic, well, yes, they are, and they’re very much like a true auto really. To clarify: a manual box is something I sort of tolerate but I can’t shift super fast or super smoothly (certainly not both at the same time) and I’m too naturally mechanically sympathetic to beat the shit out of a manual box and a clutch.

Full auto: smooth, seamless.

Dual clutch PDK: not yet been able to discern how different it is to a full auto. If I drive it on the paddles (see below), there’s no need to lift off to smooth the gear change, there’s no discernible loss of push between gears, it creeps forward unless you keep the brake covered, and in truth the only difference I’ve found so far between driving it in the paddles and not is simply pressing the paddles.

Single clutch auto stated manual (the Aston): for me the Goldilocks solution. Removes the shit bits of a full manual but retains more involvement than a full auto/dual clutch semi auto.

Still, emulating a full auto so well makes me more relaxed about Mrs 66 taking it out for a good kerbing drive.

The paddles. Hmm. Well fcuk you Porsche. If you spec the non multifunction steering wheel, you get paddles. Up on the right, down on the left. Like they should be.

But otherwise you get buttons. Quite big ones, but buttons. With your hands at 9:15, press either thumb forward and you shift up. Pull either index finger back and you shift down.

So yes, instead of up = pull right, and down = pull left, you have up = push left or right, and down = pull left or right. Which is just all fcuked up. I cope by just using the right to shift up (push instead of pull) and the left to shift down (pull). But nice one Porsche. You’ve totally cunted that up for no good reason.

What else? Not much really. The ride is and remains very comfortable. Not as soft as the FFRR but you would want that in this car. It can see-saw slightly over speed humps (at least in comfort mode) but generally I’d say it is comfortable without being cosseting and firm without being harsh. Neat trick.

Oh, and like the Aston I kerbed a wheel in a multi-storey car park the first day I had it. FFS!

The boot’s adequate (bigger than the Golf so maybe slightly better than adequate) but with the rear seats down it’s quite cavernous.

I could see myself keeping it for a while. Mrs66 likes it but offered the view that I’d sold the wrong car. Fortunately there were no blunt instruments lying around at the time.

Happy to answer any specific questions.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Deuteronomy @ Tue Nov 17, 2020 5:12 pm

This is nothing without pictures.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Greg66 @ Tue Nov 17, 2020 5:14 pm

Deuteronomy wrote:This is nothing without pictures.


Ok you demanding child!

I’ll do some tomorrow in the light. Promise.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Damien Thorn @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:29 am

I saw a Taycan this morning. A 70 plate that looked terrific in white, made for a really "graphic" shape with gloss black detailing.

But I had no idea what it was as it now torrentially down on my in the rear view mirror. Ferrari? Tesla? Only as it passed and I glimpsed the rear 3/4 was there even any Porscheyness visible.

What a thing though!
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Turntable @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:58 pm

Surprised you say that about the dual clutch thing Greg.
I find them transformational. Everything else I drive feels shit after having them and thus I only drive in auto.
GTR/McLaren/RS6 gear changes were utterly amazing and were half the joy of driving fast. Particularly in sports mode where you get a little jolt as it kicks into the next gear.

Compared with the auto paddleshifts like on my RCF or C63. Those seems so unbelievably lame compared with the dual clutches that I drove both in auto all the time as they make me sick.
My only point of reference for the single clutch was my old Maserati which was slow and cumbersome but it's old technology now so probably not a relevant point of reference.

In short, youre doing it wrong
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Aesgarth @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:12 pm

Damien Thorn wrote:I saw a Taycan this morning. A 70 plate that looked terrific in white, made for a really "graphic" shape with gloss black detailing.

But I had no idea what it was as it now torrentially down on my in the rear view mirror. Ferrari? Tesla? Only as it passed and I glimpsed the rear 3/4 was there even any Porscheyness visible.

What a thing though!

A friend's husband has just got one. In white with black bits. I quite like it but...

It's a Taycan Turbo. Pretty sure the word Turbo has no place on an electric car. Irritates me mildly. Still an incredible looking thing.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Greg66 @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:27 pm

A6CB78DD-3CF2-4A57-974F-6D0FB27586C0.jpeg
It’s a car. A red car.
A6CB78DD-3CF2-4A57-974F-6D0FB27586C0.jpeg (34.46 KiB) Viewed 130 times


F4E84A71-EBB7-4F6A-B9FB-26C0C6A84F98.jpeg
That screen on the right - multifunction. Useful.
F4E84A71-EBB7-4F6A-B9FB-26C0C6A84F98.jpeg (78.21 KiB) Viewed 130 times


1A18E0B0-E746-4AA1-B983-2B724017763B.jpeg
Blank buttons for the tight-fisted.
1A18E0B0-E746-4AA1-B983-2B724017763B.jpeg (93.46 KiB) Viewed 130 times
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Greg66 @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:30 pm

D194F5D7-E470-4F2A-B9FC-E44C9A681BC5.jpeg
Just two in the rear please
D194F5D7-E470-4F2A-B9FC-E44C9A681BC5.jpeg (78.67 KiB) Viewed 130 times


D475B819-EB4F-4261-984F-E86A310F3535.jpeg
This bit is quite nice
D475B819-EB4F-4261-984F-E86A310F3535.jpeg (95.58 KiB) Viewed 130 times


E37A1339-0D29-43E4-BA2D-8047FDBEB10A.jpeg
Boot space
E37A1339-0D29-43E4-BA2D-8047FDBEB10A.jpeg (83.72 KiB) Viewed 130 times
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Deuteronomy @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:42 pm

Turntable wrote:Surprised you say that about the dual clutch thing Greg.
I find them transformational. Everything else I drive feels shit after having them and thus I only drive in auto.
GTR/McLaren/RS6 gear changes were utterly amazing and were half the joy of driving fast. Particularly in sports mode where you get a little jolt as it kicks into the next gear.

Compared with the auto paddleshifts like on my RCF or C63. Those seems so unbelievably lame compared with the dual clutches that I drove both in auto all the time as they make me sick.
My only point of reference for the single clutch was my old Maserati which was slow and cumbersome but it's old technology now so probably not a relevant point of reference.

In short, youre doing it wrong


The gearbox in the RS6 is in fact a 'normal' ZF 8 speed fluid flywheel and not a dual clutch.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Greg66 @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:43 pm

Deuteronomy wrote:
Turntable wrote:Surprised you say that about the dual clutch thing Greg.
I find them transformational. Everything else I drive feels shit after having them and thus I only drive in auto.
GTR/McLaren/RS6 gear changes were utterly amazing and were half the joy of driving fast. Particularly in sports mode where you get a little jolt as it kicks into the next gear.

Compared with the auto paddleshifts like on my RCF or C63. Those seems so unbelievably lame compared with the dual clutches that I drove both in auto all the time as they make me sick.
My only point of reference for the single clutch was my old Maserati which was slow and cumbersome but it's old technology now so probably not a relevant point of reference.

In short, youre doing it wrong


The gearbox in the RS6 is in fact a 'normal' ZF 8 speed fluid flywheel and not a dual clutch.


<stands next to Doots>

<crossed arms and frowns hard at Teets>
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Deuteronomy @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:44 pm

Greg66 wrote:
A6CB78DD-3CF2-4A57-974F-6D0FB27586C0.jpeg


F4E84A71-EBB7-4F6A-B9FB-26C0C6A84F98.jpeg


1A18E0B0-E746-4AA1-B983-2B724017763B.jpeg


Looks very nice Greggers, I like it, especially in red.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by S1K @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:08 pm

I’ve never had a V6 Gregg but I have passengered in a 2.8 Capri once. Is it a bit like that?
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Turntable @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:08 pm

Deuteronomy wrote:
Turntable wrote:Surprised you say that about the dual clutch thing Greg.
I find them transformational. Everything else I drive feels shit after having them and thus I only drive in auto.
GTR/McLaren/RS6 gear changes were utterly amazing and were half the joy of driving fast. Particularly in sports mode where you get a little jolt as it kicks into the next gear.

Compared with the auto paddleshifts like on my RCF or C63. Those seems so unbelievably lame compared with the dual clutches that I drove both in auto all the time as they make me sick.
My only point of reference for the single clutch was my old Maserati which was slow and cumbersome but it's old technology now so probably not a relevant point of reference.

In short, youre doing it wrong


The gearbox in the RS6 is in fact a 'normal' ZF 8 speed fluid flywheel and not a dual clutch.


Actually Im a bit glad. I googled when I got to the RS6 because it didn't quite fit in with the other two, and got the information for the new one.
I don't even know what 'normal ZF 8 speed fluid flywheel' means, but assuming it is just an auto? it is noticeably better than the c63/RCf . Are they the same?
In any case, my point is still valid.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Turntable @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:08 pm

Greg66 wrote:
A6CB78DD-3CF2-4A57-974F-6D0FB27586C0.jpeg

]


Brilliant colour combo. Don't think I have seen one in red before but it works.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by thekungfury @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:10 pm

Surprised it's a strict 4-seater. That would rule it out for some.

Ford used to offer the ST as a 4-seat option which I thought was bizarre for a family hatch.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Greg66 @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:11 pm

S1K wrote:I’ve never had a V6 Gregg but I have passengered in a 2.8 Capri once. Is it a bit like that?


Mark 2?

Yes, but without the whip aerial, obvs.
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Turntable @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:34 pm

Do you still have the Aston Greg.
Is this your everyday car or a replacement?
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Re: Some words - cars

Post by Il Duce @ Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:47 pm

The rear seat belts.

Why are they fastened?
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